making a faster FTO?

ANBU_fto · Post by **ANBU_fto** » Mon Jun 14, 2004 5:10 pm

thanks

but roughy... how much would the whole turbo conversion cost?
and would the prices be same all round?

Jeff · Post by **Jeff** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 3:09 pm

The prices vary greatly depending on how far you go. I amturboing mine soon in Brisbane and have it narrowed down to 2 places.
Your best bet is to ring arround a few performance places ( best found in magazines, Hi performance imports , Zoom ,etc.) and ask if they do custom turbo jobs. If yes start asking if they have ever worked on an FTO. The ask what they would recomend.
Cheapest $8000 for T25 turbo, lousy intercooler, cheapest engine management, cheap blow off valve and retain most of the exhaust.
Dearest $15,000 for T30GT turbo, great intercooler, Haltech comp, 3 inch custom exhaust all the way, etc,etc.
The cheapest system would take you from 100kw atw to 160-180. the dearest to 200-250 kw. I`ll be going for something in between.
I think Danny has spent over $30,000 on his and is producing over 400hp ATW.
So it is all down to how much you have to spend.
Set your budget, ring a few places, see what parts they will use for that money then compare.

Jeff

GPXXX · Post by **GPXXX** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 4:27 pm

you'd be doing very well if you can find a workshop in Oz who has turbocharged an FTO.... only ones i can think of is RPM in Adelaide and another one in Perth (can't remember the workshop).

to be honest 160-180kw at the wheels is quite a big ask from an internally std FTO (assuming you're referring to the MIVEC engine). most workshops i've spoken to reckons that 7-8psi is about as high as you can get before you start damaging the rods/pistons...

last time we spoke about this, Scracy is running 7.5psi from his GT28 and he's getting roughly about 150kw atw (claimed) with a better torque convertor on his tiptronic MIVEC turbo (with an additional injector).

angela (EXC) had her tip MIVEC turbo'd as well with stock injectors (accord to Zoom) and it gave her about 130kw-ish, but she's had some work done to it since so i have no idea what sort of mumbo she's got now...

what does your package consist of Jeff? and who are the workshops willing to take on the project?

WILL · Post by **WILL** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 8:54 pm

The other workshop that has turbocharged a FTO in WA is called SSR garage.

The setup on that car was using a CT turbo from a soarer. However the car was for sale after a few months (due to a blown engine).

That was like 4-5 years ago.

ANBU_fto · Post by **ANBU_fto** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 9:01 pm

wow....

what if i was to change the pistons... can i get a greater boost???
and wouldnt i need LSD???? where would i get one of those???

plus any place in melbourne?

RallyMad · Post by **RallyMad** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 8:09 pm

Why do you say you will need an LSD mate? I know that the cusco diffs are the only diffs I know of made aftermarket for the FTO, and as far as I know it only fits manual FTO's. As for pistons as well, you shouldn't need to buy forged ones unless you run more than about the 7 or 8 psi that is talked about here.

ANBU_fto · Post by **ANBU_fto** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 9:24 pm

i have a manual fto...
kekekaka i have no idea what a LSD does.....
and yea i do want to run more then the 7 or 8 psi

ruchi · Post by **ruchi** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 9:34 pm

without going into detail (unless you want me too

) a LSD will improve straight line launching speed (where your wheels can slip / spin) but does so at the expense of cornering performance.

MADFTO · Post by **MADFTO** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 10:44 am

Hmmmm I don't think it'd actually deteriorate the cornering performance that much, it'd be negliable. LSDs should only operate when there is a torque difference between the two wheels, the torque difference between two wheels while cornering with a neutral throttle setting shouldn't trigger the LSD.

It's one of those debatable things I guess, because an LSD will improve corner exiting accleration, more so in the wet.

I don't remember what type of LSD version Rs get, I think it's 1.5 way but I'm not sure =)

Guess there's only one way to find out . . . drive on two surfaces and brake hard =P Well I could ask Mistu but where the fun in that =P

ruchi · Post by **ruchi** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 10:50 am

When cornering the inside wheel travels less distance than the outside wheel, as such the outside wheel needs to turn more than the inside wheel does. To a LSD this appears that the outside wheel is spinning and it attempts to compensate by giving more power to the inside wheel and less to the outside wheel. On a FWD car this will increase the amount of understeer which will decrease your cornering performance.

The above issue is primarily on the entrance and apex of the corner, however when exiting the corner, Eric is spot on, you will be able to put your foot down and exit better.

FTO338 · Post by **FTO338** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 10:56 am

So another word the loss u had when you enter the corner would be compensated by the exit from the same corner.

Well i guess is all depends on the driver as well then.

ANBU_fto · Post by **ANBU_fto** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 7:53 pm

but an LSD will be needed if u want more boost...?

im so lost i just red what u guys wrote and it just went psssst, straight over me head....

ruchi · Post by **ruchi** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 8:02 pm

LSD only comes into effect when one wheel is spinning more than the other. It helps to minimise the loss in performance when this happens by apply the power to the other wheel.

Jeff · Post by **Jeff** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 8:11 pm

No you don`t need a LSD (limited slip diff), but you do need strengthened gearbox/clutch. Danny is having great trouble keeping a clutch in place.
As for boost, my understanding is that the standard engine will take 7psi only. With a decompression head gasket you can up that boost slightly keeping the internals standard. Thats my plan, decompresssion gasket and run 7 psi on the road and boost to 14 psi on the track. If you want to go higher you`ll need forged pistons, cranks, etc, big money.

GPXXX, the guys in Qld you are willing to try the FTO are Subzero on the Gold Coast. They have the fastest GTR33 at present. And Hardcore racing at Logan. I have spent a great deal of time speaking to the actual mechanics (not salespeople) about recomendations, difficulties, ecu`s, etc. Both of these 2 workshops have built very fast cars, and seem to know what they are on about.
Jeff

Post by **smorison** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 8:25 pm

ANBU_fto wrote: and yea i do want to run more then the 7 or 8 psi

if you are seroius i would start here.... you will find there is a ton of torque steer with 8psi... going more will make it even harder to drive....

ANBU_fto · Post by **ANBU_fto** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 8:54 pm

tru tru fair enough with the troque...
alwells ill just have to wait and see if i would like to kill myself faster.... kekekaka
thanks for all that, i might just stick with the normal 7-9psi, (if i ever get a turbo conversion....)

GPXXX · Post by **GPXXX** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 11:33 am

Jeff, i'm curious to know how thick your decomp gasket is gonna be because if you wanna run 14psi, i'd imagine you'd have to lower your compression down to maybe below 9.0:1... with lower compression, you will find that off-boost response will be compromised somewhat (based on the turbo you are intending to use)...

i have thought about using decomp gaskets before as well and while they are cheap to buy, they are very expensive to fit (unless you carry out the work yourself, assuming you know what you're doing). Last time i spoke to Dave from RPW, they have graphite gaskets for sale which lowers the compression to about 9.0:1 and that will only allow about 10psi on stock pistons... *shrugs*

Jeff · Post by **Jeff** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 4:44 pm

The gasket is the one from RPW. I was talking about running on 7psi most of the time with the occaisional track day boosting to 14. The thing I didn`t mention on this forum but have on other forums ( I didn`t want to go off the issue ) is I `ll be running a 6A13. The extra 500cc will hopefully negate any turbo lag on the T28.
With the standard 6A12 decompressed, this should still take 7psi all day long with the ocaisional squirt to 14 not doing to much damage. As long as the fuel pump and injectors are upgraded.
Jeff

GPXXX · Post by **GPXXX** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 4:59 pm

yerrr, i sorta gethered that you're gonna be using a 6A13 after reading your post in Danny's thread LoL...

I don't think you need to use a decomp plate on the 6A13 because the CR is pretty low from the factory already, and since Danny is running 14psi from a GT30 on std internals without much issues (other than traction LoL) it should be a walk in the park for the GT28 that you intend to use...

For the 6A12 however, it should be able to run 7psi all day reliably on stock 10.0:1 compression and factory internals provided you have the cooling system and tuning (incl fuel and ignition mapping) right on the money.