to Supercharge or to turbo

venus · Post by **venus** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 9:36 pm

Hey peoples, i own a GPX and i got told it is difficult to turbo a mivec engine, so i thought supercharge but what is better for my money and performance and what size should i get and i just need help as i am new doing up cars. Also where should i go as i am in brisbane.

Hellsmurf · Post by **Hellsmurf** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 10:13 pm

ok, i think this has been roughly covered a few times before (search twice before posting), but still, here goes...

the problem with adding and sort of forced induction to the 6A12 motor, MIVEC or not, is the high compression ratio...Mitsubishi deliberatly set this super-high to get the most out of the engine in NA form...

In order to add any sort of boost, you would have to fit a thicker head gasket and/or shorter pistons to lower the compression, so that the engine wouldn't detonate with boost...

Another major problem is the engine layout of the FTO...it is difficult to fit either a turbo or a supercharger due mostly to a lack of space and high heat in the engine bay...

Another prohibiting factor of adding boost is the rest of the system...a lot of people don't add into the cost of boosting the engine is the ancillaries: you would need an intercooler, a fuel pump, rising rate fuel regulator, uprated injectors, a custom exhaust manifold for a turbo, a fully programmable engine management system, a 3" exhaust....and thats just in the engine....you would also need a new clutch in a manual or torque converter in the tip, possibly a strengthened gearbox, uprated brakes, the full works....

Add into that the cost of installation, which will be *many* hours for a skilled mechanic, and the fabrication of custom parts, like the exhaust manifold and intercooler tubing...

basically, turbocharging the engine is the simpler way to go, as a few people here have done, such as Scracy or dannyboy (who actually transplanted a 6A13 turbo)...it will cost you a lot though...

if you really want to go fast, your best bet would be to by a differant car....that said, anything is possible with money...

Hellsmurf · Post by **Hellsmurf** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 10:17 pm

*pant pant pant*

god that was a long post lol...hope it helps though!

perhaps ruchi, dannyboy, scracy or anyone else can add anything and correct me if (or more like where) i'm wrong?

venus · Post by **venus** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 11:33 pm

thank you heaps for all that, i need to sot and ponder what i need to do. hmmmmm

i will let you know in the future what i decide to do.

Hellsmurf · Post by **Hellsmurf** » Sat Mar 27, 2004 11:44 pm

no problem....

tell you what, whilst digging through my files, i found a 2 part pdf from Zoom magazine about an FTO turbo conversion...

its about 4 megs all up, if someone could please host it then we could distribute it for everyone to read...

venus if you PM me your email ill try sending it directly to you...

the other thing you can do is talk directly to Scracy, dannyboy or any other turbo nutcase and see what they have to say about costs and difficulties....

FTO338 · Post by **FTO338** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 6:54 pm

Hellsmurf wrote:no problem....

tell you what, whilst digging through my files, i found a 2 part pdf from Zoom magazine about an FTO turbo conversion...

Or better yet, ask the owner directly, which is FLYGIRL

Hellsmurf · Post by **Hellsmurf** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 8:26 pm

ahhhh so thats whose it was...

anyone wanna host the files yet?

venus · Post by **venus** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 9:48 pm

Thank you for all that it is great. I have been doing some research today and i found out there in a 3 litre mivec engine i am trying to find out if it will fit in the FTO engine bay and see where i can go with that. What do people think of that idea.

FTO338 · Post by **FTO338** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 10:01 pm

3L MIVEC??? Never heard of it before................

venus · Post by **venus** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 10:28 pm

This will make u laugh, it is only available in Japan and it comes out of a car called pajero EVO, so even there 4wd have mivecs in them how cool. so i am making enquiries to see how it may fit in the FTO. it is soooo exciting.

ruchi · Post by **ruchi** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 10:39 pm

Doing a quick search on the net it would appear that this engine is the same as a Magna but with Mivec. It is listed as a 6G74 and is available as 3L and 3.5L (just like the Magnas changed from a 3L to a 3.5L in the late '90s).

In short... no go

Three questions:
1) What is your budget?
2) What is your timeframe?
3) Are you serious about doing this or just loosely exploring the option?

venus · Post by **venus** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 10:52 pm

That is why i am researching i need to look at the cost, secondly my time frame is about 5 years as i want to get another car so i can have the FTO as a race car and i am serious in doing this as i want to be different to the usual. so it gives me time to be able to do it properly. it is just an idea as i have not heard of anyone doing it.

ruchi · Post by **ruchi** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 11:30 pm

A number of people have turbo FTO's, more commonly overseas, but there's also a few here in Australia.

Cost will be around the same for turboing any other variable timing engine and the price will vary depending upon equipment used, but $10K is a nice round figure.

But all this is academic if you're not looking at doing this for another 5 years. By then prices and technology will have changed.

jonowong · Post by **jonowong** » Sun Mar 28, 2004 11:42 pm

have you ever considered wet nitorus?

GPXXX · Post by **GPXXX** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 1:38 pm

turboing the FTO certainly has its challenges, just like any other car but it is certainly not impossible... the only reason why it's such a challenge is because not many ppl know much about them so aftermarket support is very limited here in Oz...

having said that, a turbo conversion on the FTO will also depend on your needs. obviously the more power you want, the more complicated the job will be hence the more money you would have to fork out for the job...

i am looking at a turbo conversion on my MIVEC as well very soon (after easter) and so far the cost looks to be close to the $7K mark (with a near as-new 2nd hand turbo from a JDM 200SX T28 ballbearing) driveaway, HOPEFULLY. i'll keep you all up to date on its progress when the time comes...

FTO338 · Post by **FTO338** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 2:30 pm

GPXXX wrote:i am looking at a turbo conversion on my MIVEC as well very soon (after easter) and so far the cost looks to be close to the $7K mark (with a near as-new 2nd hand turbo from a JDM 200SX T28 ballbearing) driveaway, HOPEFULLY. i'll keep you all up to date on its progress when the time comes...

So you doing the same setup as scracy? & whos doing it?

scracy · Post by **scracy** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 6:44 pm

Actually Hellsmurf you dont need to decompress the mivec engine at all,so long as you dont go silly with the boost levels (no more than 7 psi).All engine internals can remain stock at this level of boost,which should still be reliable. Engine management can also remain stock provided you wire in a fuel cut defencer and add an additional injector plus controller.Turbo charging is easier than supercharging and will also give you more overall power gain(supercharging actually uses engine power to make power)Also supercharging puts a hell of a lot more stress on gearboxes driveshafts clutches etc. because the power gain whilst not as high overall as turbo charging is instantanious,not as progressive as turbo charging.Both methods of forced induction have their advantages and disadvantages.

GPXXX · Post by **GPXXX** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 6:59 pm

FTO338 wrote:
GPXXX wrote:i am looking at a turbo conversion on my MIVEC as well very soon (after easter) and so far the cost looks to be close to the $7K mark (with a near as-new 2nd hand turbo from a JDM 200SX T28 ballbearing) driveaway, HOPEFULLY. i'll keep you all up to date on its progress when the time comes...
So you doing the same setup as scracy? & whos doing it?

i'm building it to run 10psi+ reliably all day (so yes, i'm looking at stronger internals / decomp gaskets, budget permitting) but you'll find some major differences in manifold design for the turbo

FTO338 · Post by **FTO338** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 7:12 pm

Just to let you guys know, i've already send an email to C.A.P.A (supercharge specialist) last week, with info on FTO engines & see what they have to say about supercharging FTO. So i hope they reply sometime this yr.

I agree with scracy, i've seen few blow up honda engines with supercharger, & also someone in this forum said RPW use to do supercharge for FTO but not anymore for the same reason.

Post by **smorison** » Mon Mar 29, 2004 7:29 pm

FTO338 wrote:
I agree with scracy, i've seen few blow up honda engines with supercharger, & also someone in this forum said RPW use to do supercharge for FTO but not anymore for the same reason.

RPW products can be a bit rough around the edges so i would be careful about using them as a standard, however as no one else has attempted to s/charge a FTO i guess we have to.