Tonne of Modifications coming, need some advice

[mr-charisma]

Okay, I've got a few major mods for my car coming up now that I've got my Mivec back, these things WILL be happening, not just plans... i'm just biting the bullet & forking out the cash... But I just need some advice on a few things. (P.S. I have searched)

Things that will be going onto my car;

Extractors
Full 2.5" Stainless Steel Exhaust w/high flow metal cat (mandrel bent)
Twin Mufflers
Brake Master Cylinder - 1" Bore upgrade
Brake Discs - DBA 4000 Series gold rotors 276mm
Brake pads - RB74 Racebrakes pads (depending on condition of current pads)
Braided Brake Lines
Bored out throttle body (65mm) (from ebay, not RPW)
New Front Strut Brace - Whiteline
New Rear Strut Brace - Whiteline
'Field' AFC - (Fairly Cheapo AFC unit, but hopefully should be okay)
Magnecor Ignition leads
New Iridium Spark Plugs (Next 5000km)

Now here is my dilemma;

These things are already costing me a few dollars... but ... I have read that to get the most out of the extractors & throttle body you should get the Fuel Pressure regulator as well ... for another $150 is this going to be worth it? (Not gonna get it from RPW, is cheaper elsewhere)

Also, should I definately get the larger intake manifold if I am doing all these mods? Or is it going to be fine if I get the Intake Manifold done at a later point?

If I get the larger intake manifold later on, is my car going to need to be tuned again?

Everything except for the exhaust, Extractors & AFC I am going to be installing myself.

With all of these mods, am I going to need to get an aftermarket ECU rather than mucking around with the AFC?

I will be getting the car tuned once everything has been installed, I know of a place in Brisbane that works on performance cars & has done at least 1 turbo setup on an FTO that I know of & shouldn't be any probs tuning it .... but does anyone know of a good dyno tuner /workshop in QLD?

Thanks in advance guys

[EURO]

Probably better people to ask - but why dont you get a SAFC II rathen then AFC? I bought mine brand new for $220 - and much better then an afc

[mr-charisma]

i already picked up the Field AFC a long while ago when SAFC II were about $600 or something, so I'll try to avoid buying a different one if I can get away with it ....

.. could be wrong on this, but from what I've read the Apexi SAFCII is more for looks than performance, & doesn't do too much more than the Field AFC unit for the $$ ... will have a look into the SAFCII as well though, especially at around the $200 mark, thanks heaps

[FtoSam]

you wont need to worry about re-tuning unless you expect more than 15kw or so difference.

So if u get your extractors, exhaust, a good intake, leads and plugs, theres not much more u can do to go quicker.

And getting brakes and braces are a better idea, as its easier and cheaper to make an fto handle like crazy then make one go like crazy...

And with those mods, it should make a big difference..

Cant wait to see (and Hear) it when its done..

Nice picks on mods too... they all are probably the best bang for buck mods. Larger intake i dont think will make much more than 4-5 kw at the most. Better off getting lightweight flywheel, pullys, etc... but i think what you've got there sounds perfect.

Not sure about the AFM... and a RR FPR are good... I think worth the investment...
Pretty sure ben has one...

[mr-charisma]

lol, thanks for the encouragement Sam I was just having one of those "OMG What have I done?" moments where I freaked out about how much money I am spending & wondering where the hell it is going to end ... lol, I am sure you know what I'm talking about

I think I am going to be very happy with it all, & money well spent though

Have just found a couple of posts that I missed, decided on getting the Fuel Pressure Regulator, still undecided on whether or not to get a piggyback ...

I think that this comment from Ben is worthy of a sticky post in itself;

I'll give you a hand here Kev

Jap80x - just keep in mind when modding an FTO for power there is very little in the way of 'off the shelf' go fast bits... In fact after intakes & exhausts, thats it - its off to the engineering shop you go. With that in mind - you will NEVER make 250hp without sticking a turbo or blower on it.
Having said that - I'll see what I can do with you list here....

extractors - available through RPW www.rpw.com.au. Approx $600. These units pump a 2.5 inch feed to your cat. Once these are installed you will only get the full potential if you relace the cat, resonator, muffler with high flow units & some nice mandrel bent 2.5" stainless pipe. Another $6-800.
Throttle body - Also available through RPW www.rpw.com.au
Easiest way to do it? Take your own TB down to an engineering shop & have them bore it out, fit a larger brass butterfly & machine the inlet out.
$100 worth of machining

n/a custom plenum - No such thing off the shelf. Again down to the machine / performance shop & have it ported to your specs. Some of us here have had it done.

injectors - No point if you are staying NA. The stock fuel system only runs at 60% capacity during full throttle using 167cc injectors

forged pistons/rings or stronger pistons/rings. - No point if you are staying NA. We have guys here running 6-8 pound boost on turbo FTOs with no issues with the stock internal. If you were to upgrade them, it would be purley for longevity reasons. Not only that, no-one makes a forged piston for an FTO motor. Its just not available. You'd have to strip the motor down, pull out the stockie & take them to a performace shop & see what forgies they could match up or modify to fit.

fuel system - Only item that we recommend upgrading in the fuel system is adding a 1.7:1 rising rate fuel pressure regulator. If you really need more out of the pump, there is an uprated aftermarket unit available from the UK www.camskill.co.uk. There is also a minor mod you can do to the connector line that joins the fuel rails. Its a 1/4" pipe that chokes the rear bank a little bit a bit & as a result the front cylinders tend to run rich on FTO's. That pipe can be upgraded with some custom setup. The fuel rail can also be replaced with custom rails cut to size. RPW again can supply these.

racing leads and plugs - Leads are available from Magnecor http://www.magnecor.com.au/ get some nice 8mm lead. You cannot go any bigger as the lead cannot be pushed into the Mitsubishi plug boot if its over 8mm

Plugs - I recommend an NGK Iridium unit. Other folks have different brand preference but tend to go for the same type of long life unit. Any auotshop can get these in for you

custom manifold - Not available off the shelf. Again, down to the machine shop & tell them to do what you want. Also something that some of us have had done.

cams - No hot cams are available for the FTO. You can buy a billet set from RPW for $2200, but you then have to specify the grind you want on them.

aftermarket computer - A number of options available. I dont recomment a complete engine management system. It simply doesnt need it, also the car becomes very rough when the stock ECU is removed... it runs more than just the air / fuel ratio. We recommend piggy back units when staying NA. Greddy, Apexi, Uniship, Perfect Power all make suitable units. All available through respective resellers & dealers. Price ranging from about $800 to $2000 installed & dyno tuned.
and so on...

As the Integra was released to a worldwide market - the world has had time & resources available to develope go-fast bits, especially in the states. The FTO was only ever intended for the Japanese domestic market. Eventually it found its way out to places like New Zealand & the UK, but with such small numbers that performance developement for them was not economically viable. We have to make it up as we go!

If you want me to elaborate on any of the above, just ask

[khunjeng]

First. Its a N/A so the most important thing is intake then exhaust.

I would spend my time changing the intake setup such that you have a complete sealed intake with a direct feed from the front bar. I would also get a bigger intake pipe (similar to UAS style) and the larger 65mm TB is a good idea. I have a magna TB that you can use if you like. This should be step 1 and I would spend some time working this out.

#1 : Intake
Sealed box
TB Intake pipe
Replace fresh air feed from front bar
Pod or pannel filter in the box

On the exhuast side. The rpw extractors (clean them up and spent some time doing this) + the down/flex pipe feeding into a 2.5" system with quality high flow cat (700+CFM) and good mufflers however you wish to do it.

#2 Exhaust
High Flow Cat (700CFM+)
New muffler (good flow)
Downpipes
Extractors
Mandral Bent is a bit of a waste IMO, costs u much more for little gain.

I few studies have shown with the free'ing up of the zorst your AFRs are improved and come close to where they should be. However I would invest in an SAFCII as a minimum as it can some good readouts which are useful.

#3 ECU
SAFCI/II
Emanage Blue

On the suspension side i would (if not already done) invest in a good set of shockers and springs then upgrade with the whiteline swaybar set + strut brace, following this so the breaks. You power upgrade is not so big that the break upgrade is as necessary on the GPX but would be good, but better bang for bucks IMO are the ones about. Also get soem good jap lightweight wheels..not heavy cheap ones.

#4 Suspension etc
Suspension + Springs
Swaybars
Front Strut Brace

#5 Brakes
New Pads
Braided lines
Slotted/Thicker Discs

[mr-charisma]

Thanks KJ Loads of good points there

Just installed my new Air intake, 3.5" HKS Superflow pod, & 3" piping to the TB need to do a few things to improve on it, i'm not going to have it in a box per se' but it will have heat shielding on all sides & completely blocked off from any hot air sources ..

With my exhaust, I was thinking of making the first half after the cat - as non mandrel bent, as there are no 90' degree bends, but then in thesecond half back to the mufflers there are a few 90's that I want to get mandrel bent... depends if i can get a good price on it..

What can you tell me about mufflers? Best to go with Name brand for this? there are a few on ebay that I've been trying to decide whether or not to get.. mostly name brand replicas etc..
Not wanting it to be too loud, just a nice deep sound ..

Extractors:
Cleaning them? is this filing down misformed blobs of metal or something?

Suspension:
Just replaced suspension, KYB Excel-G struts, standard springs, poly bushes all round...
Getting Front & rear braces & replacing Front & rear droplinks
Rear swaybar at a later point ... a few months at least, not sure about front

Brakes:
Stock discs are warped, need to be replaced asap with some a pair of slotted... should actually be doing this before making it faster

[Grue]

OK... now that's scarey Was just doing some research to post an almost identical thread! Going to be doing very similar over the next 6months, so let us know how it goes.

Widening the Intake manifold isn't a big job by the sounds of it, and if you're going for a 65mm TB, might as well do it at the same time.

[khunjeng]

Thanks KJ Loads of good points there

Just installed my new Air intake, 3.5" HKS Superflow pod, & 3" piping to the TB need to do a few things to improve on it, i'm not going to have it in a box per se' but it will have heat shielding on all sides & completely blocked off from any hot air sources ..

With my exhaust, I was thinking of making the first half after the cat - as non mandrel bent, as there are no 90' degree bends, but then in thesecond half back to the mufflers there are a few 90's that I want to get mandrel bent... depends if i can get a good price on it..

What can you tell me about mufflers? Best to go with Name brand for this? there are a few on ebay that I've been trying to decide whether or not to get.. mostly name brand replicas etc..
Not wanting it to be too loud, just a nice deep sound ..

Extractors:
Cleaning them? is this filing down misformed blobs of metal or something?

Suspension:
Just replaced suspension, KYB Excel-G struts, standard springs, poly bushes all round...
Getting Front & rear braces & replacing Front & rear droplinks
Rear swaybar at a later point ... a few months at least, not sure about front

Brakes:
Stock discs are warped, need to be replaced asap with some a pair of slotted... should actually be doing this before making it faster

I've had a look at your intake. I would be spending time on that before you spend on other stuff.

I would go sway bars, they make a massive difference to handeling. Mandral bend is just a technique of bending pipes, I know peeopl using std piping tools make it pretty damn good. You wont see know the difference. Lo.ks goof though/

[dstocks]

The rpw extractors (clean them up and spent some time doing this) + the down/flex pipe feeding into a 2.5" system with quality high flow cat (700+CFM) and good mufflers however you wish to do it.

Sam, please explain 'clean them up'. I have just got mine (havent installed yet) and would like to know what you are referring to before I put them on.

Oh and are there any paints that you can buy that will take the kind of temp a hot exhaust will produce, or do I have to go ceramic to get that. I was thinking that the same stuff that you can coat brake calipers with might do it - Am I wrong.......

Oh, and sorry to hijack the thread....

[khunjeng]

The rpw extractors (clean them up and spent some time doing this) + the down/flex pipe feeding into a 2.5" system with quality high flow cat (700+CFM) and good mufflers however you wish to do it.

Sam, please explain 'clean them up'. I have just got mine (havent installed yet) and would like to know what you are referring to before I put them on.

Oh and are there any paints that you can buy that will take the kind of temp a hot exhaust will produce, or do I have to go ceramic to get that. I was thinking that the same stuff that you can coat brake calipers with might do it - Am I wrong.......

Oh, and sorry to hijack the thread....

Its pretty common that your extarctors will need to be smoothed. Have a look at them and see if the inside is rough, there are lips in the intake edges or on the joins. Spend some time getting this right.

[dstocks]

What is it best to do this with; a drill attachment, by hand and how smooth should I aim for. Im guessing youll say the smoother the better.

[khunjeng]

What is it best to do this with; a drill attachment, by hand and how smooth should I aim for. Im guessing youll say the smoother the better.

Ben has done this, I actually sent mine back and never did it. I would use a file and smooth it out and finish off with some sand paper. In reality it should be done properly (i.e. like Hooning, porting). Also have a look at the join of the three pipes (joiner) have a look and tell me what you think.

[Richy]

this is one pretty damn good thread...as i am planning in the next few months to do something similar (started by getting the apexi pod filter from Tushar, 65mm tb, leads & extractor from rpw)

very informative mr-charisma with quote of ben's...

[mr-charisma]

this is one pretty damn good thread...as i am planning in the next few months to do something similar (started by getting the apexi pod filter from Tushar, 65mm tb, leads & extractor from rpw)

very informative mr-charisma with quote of ben's...

One is glad to be of service ... I've been reading through all of the Technical |Performance threads & am writing up a few all encompassing guides to performance mods, should be a big help to new members, and old members as well to have as much info as possible in the one place.

The Cold Air Intake one is almost ready to go, just need to scrape together some pictures ..

The one for exhausts is mostly done, but need some more information & pics..

[FtoSam]

Awesome job mate... I was going to suggest something along those lines anyway to you..

If you need pics i have heaps of under car pics of mine. mainly focusing on the exhaust.

[dstocks]

I've been reading through all of the Technical |Performance threads & am writing up a few all encompassing guides to performance mods

If you are doing that, can I republish them as guides on Complete FTO please.

[mr-charisma]

Awesome job mate... I was going to suggest something along those lines anyway to you..

If you need pics i have heaps of under car pics of mine. mainly focusing on the exhaust.

Yep I have a few of your exhaust that I was going to use if you didn't mind...

If you are doing that, can I republish them as guides on Complete FTO please.

Yep, feel free

Since a fair chunk of it will be opinions of members etc ... anyone will be free to make additions or expand on bits if they want to .. but not neccessarily make changes or delete things.. Will do my best to credit everyone I steal from, lol

[FtoSam]

Awesome job mate... I was going to suggest something along those lines anyway to you..

If you need pics i have heaps of under car pics of mine. mainly focusing on the exhaust.

Yep I have a few of your exhaust that I was going to use if you didn't mind...

If you are doing that, can I republish them as guides on Complete FTO please.

Yep, feel free

Since a fair chunk of it will be opinions of members etc ... anyone will be free to make additions or expand on bits if they want to .. but not neccessarily make changes or delete things.. Will do my best to credit everyone I steal from, lol

No worries...
Im actually looking into making a complete FTO information book.
free of course... But similair to what you're doing but much bigger.
So you can use all my pics and info if i can use yours... hehehe

[SG]

theres a recent post on ftooc about the throttle bodies... going from 60mm or whatever up to 65mm. someones done some back to back dyno tests (putting it on a dyno, doing a few runs, then putting the upgraded one on) and they reckon theres no difference.. maybe half a kilowatt. Think they even had the flange b o r e d on the plenum aswell... so I duno. Maybe you need the whole plenum b o r e d out, but i havent looked at one. The theory they had was that you need bigger cams to draw in the extra air, and thats why the GR has the 63mm.

http://ftooc.org/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t= ... sc&start=0